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 Post subject: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 26th, 2015, 4:34 pm 
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I'm getting kind of stumped by this one.

I have a Witness P Compact in 10mm and I really, really want to love the gun. I like the round, the gun fits well in hand and shoots well. However, lately it's really been having lots of feed issues.

At first it was reticent to return to battery. A tap on the slide would knock it back into battery. I polished the hell out of the feed ramp and that seemed to help some.

Then the problem came back, but it was definitely sticking before forcing the new round into battery. I then replaced the double recoil assembly with a single recoil assembly from Wolff Springs, going up 10% in recoil spring weight. I also replaced the mag spring with a +5% unit from Wolff. Again, this seemed to help some, but it didn't cure the problem.

It seems now as if the gun's locking open as if it were the last round on probably half of the rounds fired. Hitting the slide release drives it back to battery just fine, but it sure shouldn't be doing this. Down-loading the mag doesn't seem to help.

I'm not positive it's the magazine; the current mag feeds every round perfectly when cycled by hand. This seems to occur with all types of ammo: I've used PPU new manufacture JHP, 3D FMJ, and many handloads in different charge weights (with plated ball bullets).

However, I ordered (and just received) a new factory magazine from Midway. I don't know when I'll get a chance to hit the range to test it.

Any thoughts on what I might be missing?

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 26th, 2015, 4:43 pm 
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... not familiar with the Witness P Compact specifically, but I have a 1911 kit (10MM) and had difficultly curing feeding woes too.
The aspect ration of the cartridge, by nature, is going to feed less reliably than say a stubby a .45ACP
Time and patience. I finally got on the horn with the OEM manufacturer and asked for tips for tuning the system to improve reliability


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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 26th, 2015, 4:53 pm 
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I feel like this is something that's more recent. I've owned the gun for a number of years but don't recall feeding problems when I first bought it. I'd open the chamber mouth a bit, but the locking-open bit makes me think that maybe this isn't a cartridge issue but instead a mechanical interference.

What worked in your situation? Good call on the shape of the cartridge being less likely to feed reliably, though. I hadn't considered that.

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 26th, 2015, 4:59 pm 
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In fact, the 10mm should feed MORE reliably due to it's length-to-diameter ratio.

You say the slide lever is engaging? That when it locks open, all you have to do is manipulate the release lever? Am I understanding you correctly? If so, this is not a feed issue.

or are you saying that after not going into battery, you THEN pull the slide to be held open by the lever,...the release it,...and it feeds?

I had a Witness in .45acp that would constantly catch rounds at the case mouth where they are crimped, hanging up on the lip of the forward face of the magazine itself. I heard from others that this was pretty common with mags for that caliber in the Witness. After a little grinding and buffing on that lip,...function improved.

How exactly are the rounds hanging up? How far into battery or not? Photos would help.

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 26th, 2015, 5:21 pm 
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I had a similar problem with a different gun once, and somebody recommended that I try shooting it one-handed.
Doh! I was pushing on the slide stop with my support hand and didn't know it!

I have also seen left-handed shooters cause malfunctions in 1911s because they were touching the end of the slide stop where it protrudes through the frame.

Worth a try.

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 26th, 2015, 5:36 pm 
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Good call on the slide stop. I need to see if I can head out this weekend and take lots of photos and try to manipulate the firearm differently. If that's all it is, I wonder what changed in my hold.

atfsux, I can best describe it as a feed issue only because it doesn't enter battery. It seems like the problem is progressively stranger. The slide at this point seems to lock open between shots (this has actually happened with multiple shooters, though, leading me to believe it's not just me). Previously it seemed that the round would fail to enter the chamber completely and nose-up and hang, but a slight bump on the slide would cure that (which is why I installed the heavier recoil spring).

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 27th, 2015, 3:15 am 
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I had the first gen of the witness compact 10mm, along with slide change out to 40.
I never could get it to run reliable all the time. It seemed like a finicky filly at times, it would run like clock work, and then out of the blue would rear up and just balk at every type of ammo i used, same in the change over calibre. I sent it back twice, and it came back twice with the note, it works could not find anything wrong.

I took it as a sign, that it did not like me or my style, so gave up and passed it off to another.
He has had no issues, so its anyones guess as to issue.
I'm a decent smith when it comes to pistols, and pride myself on resolving issues, but have to say the witness stumped me.
good luck with it, I did like the results when it ran well.
Rj


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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: February 27th, 2015, 5:38 am 
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Yeah, and I'm fairly motivated to get it running 100%. I like 10mm as a versatile defensive round and the Witness P Compact is small enough to throw in my work bag. The only other compact-frame 10mm of which I can think is the Glock 29, and I'm honestly not a Glock fan. I just can't get used to the trigger and shooting ergos. I've owned several in various calibers and they've all run great, but I don't shoot that well with them and I don't enjoy them all that much.

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: June 1st, 2015, 5:03 pm 
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A buddy suggested extractor and extractor spring. Does this seem probable to anyone else?

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: June 21st, 2015, 2:42 pm 
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Last time I took this out shooting it seems like the slide stop was riding up after each round and either partially engaging the slide detent and causing the fed round to nose-dive, or it was fully engaging the slide and locking it back. I notice no aberrations on the frame, slide stop, or slide.

Looking at it closely with the slide off, I'm wondering if the magazine is dragging something and causing the slide stop to engage or drag the slide. I also noticed some coke buildup on the extractor, so I'm cleaning that with some foaming Hoppe's.

Any thoughts?

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: June 21st, 2015, 2:57 pm 
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AZS; Woohoo!
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Joined: January 3rd, 2011, 8:24 am
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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: June 26th, 2015, 7:35 am 
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Joined: September 4th, 2008, 7:39 am
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I would bet that as it feeds the round, the round is contacting the slide stop causing it to engage. I e see that on 1911s a time or two. If you look at the rear of the catch of the slide stop is there some brass smear/discoloration?
In pics two and three there it looks like there are some particles/shavings of brass on the left side to the rear of where the slide stop is.

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: June 26th, 2015, 12:49 pm 
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AZS; Woohoo!
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Y'know, that might be the case. What's the remedy -- replace the slide stop, or just file it a bit?

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 Post subject: Re: Feeding issues on a Witness 10mm
New postPosted: June 28th, 2015, 4:54 pm 
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Either or really. Personally I would try some light file work to smooth up the end portion of the slide release on the surface that faces the rounds. If you can see streaks/smears of brass discoloration on it those are the areas that need attention.

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